No worries, we've got a transcript and the recording for you right here.
Join CEO, Michael Hudson, and CTO, David Arakelian, as they answer your submitted questions about our crowdfunding campaign and talk about the future plans for Gravity.
The video recording of the Instagram Live is available to view on Vimeo, and the (auto-generated) transcript of Mike & David's conversation is below.
To invest in Bitstocks Gravity, check out our pitch on Crowdcube. [Please note: our crowdfunding campaign is now closed, thank you to all who invested]
Michael Hudson: Hello, good evening, everyone. Just waiting for my CTO to join and we can get rocking and rolling. Evening everyone, evening. Hey, how's it going? I hope everyone had a fantastic weekend. Let's talk Bitstocks, let’s talk Gravity and let's talk Bitcoin.
David Arakelian: Hey, how are you? Yeah, I can talk here. Again, you have the best setup cosy with the sofa, and I'm here to hold my mobile.
Michael: You're in Bulgaria right now, right? How's it out there?
David: Yeah. Today was good. It's a pleasant 10,15 degrees. Not bad.
Michael: Is it? It’s snowing here.
David: I noticed that. Yeah. I saw the pictures in the UK. It's going to snow here on Thursday or Wednesday.
Michael: So, all right. Well, we've got some questions and a list of questions to go through, all the major ones.
David: Yeah, sure. Let's go.
Michael: So the questions have been split into three categories. We’ll talk about the company, product, Bitcoin and technology. So just to give you a bit of a flavour as to what some of these questions are...
Bitcoin & Technology
So three different categories and then we'll just take some live as they flow in. Which one of those three would you like to cover first? Should we go for the Bitcoin one?
David: Yeah, sure, let's go for the Bitcoin ones if you want to.
Michael: Okay. All right, so what needs to happen for Bitcoin value to become more stable?
David: People need to understand more what Bitcoin was designed to start with. Because Bitcoin is a peer to peer cash - it’s as simple as that. That’s the first sentence of the whitepaper, and that's what it was designed for. And right now there is no need for the price to be stable because the utility of it is simply speculation. So what do speculators like - is movements in the market, right? That's how they make their money. Daily trading making sure that there's volatility if there's no volatility - there's no speculation. There's no need to trade on those assets. So the fulfilment of Bitcoin right now as it stands is, unfortunately, but unfortunately, the reality is simply to trade on exchanges against other assets and vice versa. So in order for us to move to a stage where Bitcoin is becoming less volatile, hence more stable will be to find what is bitcoin stably used for and one of the use cases is - Cash - is simply to be able to be used as money. And when you do use it as money, then it becomes very close to what the monetary system is, which inherently reduces the friction and the volatility of it. Right?
For me, it will be the step forward to make sure that the Bitcoin price is quite stable. Also, one other aspect of it is adoption, right? If it is a very small market and lots of people can manipulate the price such as, like buy in big chunks and sell in big chunks. You can see that the price will shoot quite high or drastically reduce in value. So we need more adoption and more people to come on board to be able to have really good liquidity of Bitcoin trading, to make sure that those who are speculators , they're basically like not interested anymore, but just purely buying and selling with those people who are really, really in need.
Michael: Totally, and to elaborate on that and also weave in Gravity, right this is something that we are directly addressing and something that I personally and we found, as a company, very frustrating in the earlier days of our company life cycle. So in the beginning, Bitstocks incorporated as an investment house. We’ve been offering that service since 2015. Now we are transitioning obviously, clearly to be very Gravity-focused on delivering on what we planned for Gravity. But in terms of where that journey began and started to diverge, was around the question - when are we ever going to achieve real utility in order to have price stability for Bitcoin? And the big issue and a challenge as to why we've not achieved it in 12 years is because this space has run around trying to force businesses to accept this different medium of exchange. Whether it be Bitcoin, Ethereum or any of these other cryptocurrencies, which in itself is a huge marketing exercise, a huge marketing challenge for one to get people utilising an asset. Suppose that is your only approach to convince them that they should utilise it; just because of the way banks do business and how the government is orchestrated, instead of saying that this could help you get more customers or improve efficiency for your business.
So what we saw is that due to the volatility with the asset itself, it is a very difficult conversation to have with any vendor at scale. So Apple is not accepting Bitcoin, Amazon's not accepting Bitcoin, because no matter who steps in as a mediator whether it be Bitpay, whether it be Coinbase (which is what they founded upon which was being a mediator between the big company that might want to accept cryptocurrency as a medium of exchange), but they only want dollars, the world works in dollars, works in Euro, works in GBP. So if it's not going to be the volatility taken on the merchant side, it means it's taken on us. Right? It's taken on the individual who's making a transaction and buying the item.
And it's terrible as a medium of exchange - what David explained by using Bitcoin as a currency, and there are actually two ways of looking at that. You've got the native way that everyone looks at it for which is - we need more acceptability, we need shops, stores, etc. accepting Bitcoin as a mechanism of payment. We are at least in my opinion, ten years away from that. Even today, we’re ten years away from that being at any degree of the scale. The other way where we could do it today, which is what Gravity is and what Gravity solution is, is that we take the best attributes of Bitcoin. Which is - being able to audit all of our financial transactions on a public record, to have micropayment ability, to be able to break up anyone denomination of Bitcoin into a hundred million particles, right which we call Satoshis. So if I take one cent, one penny, and I put it on top of this technology, I can break that Penny down to the eighth decimal place. Well now you've got, say a service like Amazon with AWS which sends you a bill per month or now, they can bill you per second because they have a payment system that can facilitate that with no volatility. So you resolve the volatile nature of Bitcoin because you're using USD or you're using GBP, but you bring the frictionless payment cross-border abilities of Bitcoin to the traditional monetary system.
Then you can approach the likes of Amazon AWS or any other vendor who can benefit from more users, more customers by broadening their customer base through this technological implementation that is how you get more users and a more people doing that then everyone needs Bitcoin to facilitate these payments and its infrastructure happening on top of Bitcoin. That's the world that will be embarking this year. And this is where we get into the subject matter or stablecoins. That's the part of execution with Gravity. Why we're building Gravity the way that we are, so we can fix this issue this year not wait on this very broken ideal of Amazon and PayPal etcetera going to accept Bitcoin as a payment mechanism, but that's just not been the case.
David: Well, they did try to accept it Mike, but that was kind of like a novelty for them, and they very quickly realised that there is no upside there are only downsides because of the volatility, because of the ways that it takes longer to accept. So they tried to accept it, but unfortunately, people don't use this cash, which’s why it failed.
Michael: Yeah. 100%. All right. So, is our company’s success, therefore linked to the price of Bitcoin and how we profit in a prolonged bear market? Do you want to tackle this and I'll add an addition to it?
David: You go for this one.
Michael: So, ultimately, the most successful is Bitcoin from a price standpoint. What does that do? It creates hype. It creates chatter. It even creates - has your Uber driver giving you recommendations on crypto prices. It really increases the buzz, the interest in Bitcoin as an asset that brings more users to Gravity. It brings more users. It creates more trading and equally on the downside. What happens to the mainstream? You hear that Bitcoin’s dead for the billionth time. Right? And I'm now talking about it from a negative standpoint. What does that do? It creates more volatility. It creates more trading opportunities, the real best way to be positioned in our opinion, clearly through evidence is to have a business that is built not only say on top of the infrastructure of Bitcoin, which I'll get into in a second, but a company that allows the trading facilitation of Bitcoin digital assets because we can make money when the market goes up or whether the market goes down - because we're still taking our spread and our transactional fee. So for us as a business, either way, we're very well-positioned because we make up fees on trading.
Secondly, as a business, we’re actually utilising technology, which is a new thing in this space. We’re utilising the Bitcoin Ledger in a way that a traditional company hasn't done. So for us, if you take the model of Monzo. Monzo as a business has found it quite difficult to monetise their business's huge user base, they found it quite difficult to monetise their business. Well, what about if Monzo could have new feature sets that users actually care about, users will care so much to utilise it. They will pay for the luxury of knowing that their financial institution, that they utilise, is solvent. So that's the hidden aspect of using this technology - that people aren't really factoring in because it's been very traditional investment and what the investment assets are doing, you’re not pricing in the opportunity of having transparency as your USP, so for us as a business, that's a great application tool for why this technology irrespective of what the price is doing is important. To then for us, we can offer a service that instead of paying £15 a month to a company like Monzo for services that don't really change your life much at all and don't give you any further degree of assurance on the entity of the institution you're banking with. Using a ledger to assure you that we actually have what is that we say we have for you? Which really, therefore, justifies the charging model which we're going to utilise with our personal account services. So that's aspects of that other than if you want to add anything else to that David.
David: No, it's as you said, it's leveraging the technology, right? So if we build on top of it and people make use of it naturally, we will have traction. They will find the utility of it. Otherwise, there is no use of it. So why would someone use it if there's no utility?
Michael: I just want to pause and stop for there's a comment from a user named All-Seeing Eye - the bottom guy looks bored and about to fall asleep. Wake up, fella. I don't think you realise this. David is a beast when it comes to coding. All the guy does is a computer like we started calling him “computer”. So, David, I know as of the back of probably a 20-hour shift coding away, yet he is still here while travelling in between and taking this call.
David: Yeah, maybe we should. Maybe we should invite him next time as well just to see his point of view.
Michael: Looks that's all right. Product. Can you give us more details on the stablecoin? And what will it be pegged to? And I'll touch on it slightly but go for it - that’s your domain.
David: Yeah, I can make that point. Yep. So first of all, why stablecoins and what does it facilitate? I think, Michael, you have touched base on - we can use stablecoins for certain things, but the most important thing for us will be facilitating - one, microtransactions because that's something that is a novelty and is not possible nowadays. We can also facilitate instant confirmations and transactions of people who accept stablecoins and are truly borderless. This is what for me is the most important one. So it's no longer required for you to go to different jurisdictions or you know companies to send money to someone as simple as that. It is as simple as sending a text message. It's instant. The person receives it, and they accept it. So I think that's the true nature of a stablecoin, which is much more stable than the normal banking financial infrastructure that we have when we transfer money, even though the banking system has caught up quite well in recent years as we know for the last two-three years. We saw that there's like a Faster Payment System, SEPA for instance. So it is catching up really really well.
The way that we are going to use stablecoins and the way that it's going to be pegged to you, it's going to be one to one. There's not going to be any speculations in the asset. The underlying asset is going to be the fiat currency, and you should be able to claim it exactly the amount that you own at any given time, and you should also be able to check the reserves at any given time. We basically advocate for full transparency for auditing and for you to fully take control of the money that you have legally and on-chain. That's what we are trying to change the way that we are trying to do with our stablecoin.
There are legal requirements that we are going through which are not difficulties or not like problems, but there are hurdles the reason that they are is that we want to be legally compliant and be safe for our customers when we operate in different countries and also be able to make sure that they have the safety of it when they are using so for us we haven't seen any stable coins, which do all of this. So the majority of the stable coins right now which exist and the closest that I can think of is USDC which is the Coinbase and Circle where they did it together with anything else for me, it just looks dodgy either. They're under investigation. They don't provide proof of reserves. There are loads of things. Is going in a way that for me raises alert and it looks shady. So we're trying to eliminate all that, that's what the promise of stablecoins overall is for us as a company.
Michael: Just to add on that, one thing. For a resounding thing that this technology addresses and fixes is, we've got a direct API link with our power bank, we're utilising, and we could then create a peg one to one by creation that when the money hits our banking provider, it immediately creates the equivalent on the Bitcoin Ledger for the stablecoin, right? One GBP, then you have one GBP here in the Bitcoin equipment with all of the abilities of Bitcoin, meaning I can break up that one GBP into millions of particles and I can make sub-penny transactions. That's a great aspect of stablecoin technology. But what that also means is that once we go inevitably cashless - we are going cashless. We are going to lose one huge factor in money, which I feel very passionately about. I think it's very important that we maintain privacy. So in a cashless society in traditional financial infrastructure, you lose all degree of privacy or degree of privacy.
In utilising Bitcoin technology and ironically public ledger technology, we are designing here with Bitstocks and Gravity. We will reinstate privacy and the attributes of cash and make that seamless and borderless. This is going to be such a huge thing and a very different psychological difference between the cashless traditional banking infrastructure and transparent banking infrastructure that is built on a public ledger. This won't be able to afford you the benefits that this one literally cannot. Beyond just the transparent nature. There are other attributes to it as well. Okay.
Michael: There's something I want to address also - one of the questions that came in was ‘why Bitcoin SV’, as opposed to Bitcoin Core (BTC). The fact that we're even speaking about stablecoin technology, is testament to that. If we were on BTC, we’d be unable to deliver on anything that we are building with Gravity, on top of BTC as a technology and I just want to make something very very clear. David and I both feel very passionately about this. The only thing that we care about isn't subscribing to some brand camp whether that is SV, BTC, Bitcoin Cash, Ethereum, EOS Ripple quite frankly - couldn't care less. The only thing we care about is, does the tech work? And does it allow me to build a business on top of it that is legally and lawfully compliant? Where the tectonic plates of technology mean that, if I build my house on this structure, and my house will be there tomorrow or would it fork off and split off and have all of these other protocol changes that make my house fall through the cracks and ultimately why am I building this in the first place.
The whole reason why I'm building this in the first place for all of you, everyone who's watching this stream and the people who are either unaware that we've been building it right now - is for Humanity. So does Humanity ultimately care about the brand of my plumbing? No. If they're using a financial institution that they can click a button and prove that their money is truly within that institution and our institution is upholding a fractional reserve ratio, that is healthy and transparent. They will use that Institution. Bitcoin is a purifier of technology; it's a technology in itself. But it's also a purifier of technology; it’s a purifier of businesses; it's a purifier of how we engage and communicate as a global collective - meaning if you engage and do commerce fraudulently, it would not prevent you from doing so. However, it will make it absolutely transparently clear that you committed them and it leaves the x on a treasure map for law effectively to come after you. And it's there forever as David accurately stipulated.
Michael: Now. I'm going to explain Bitcoin. In fact, not just Bitcoin. I'm going to explain public ledger technology in the super simple explanation of every blockchain. And even that word I use loosely, but every blockchain will subscribe to this exact same example. I'm going to give you the only innovation of Bitcoin: is it public. Okay. It's a public Ledger. What does that address? If you're going to form a contract between say two parties? To make that contract have a legal foundation and robustness, you need to have a witness present. So two people start in a property deed, right? You want to have someone else present. I witnessed Michael and David exchanging on this contract, right and even their signature. So if there was ever a dispute over the contract that person could be bought to stand and they can relate and tell the court what it is that they witnessed. Bitcoin took the need and a requirement and a cumbersome process of leading the witness to any interaction and automated the witness by making the whole world the witness by making the ledger public.
So what is a ledger? This (points to paper). Bitcoin is no more sophisticated than this. It's a digitised version of a ledger. Something that we've had for thousands of years. Don't make it more complicated than this, forget the brand name, it's just the look. In order for this ledger to have value. Do I need one of these rights (points to pen)? So now I've got this I can write a referendum, I can wage war. I can write a letter to my loved one. I can draw a Mona Lisa, but what will prevent me from doing so? Well, the pen is the token. So in Bitcoins, there are 21 million pens, 21 million tokens. Right now in BTC, one of these pens is $34,000, ok? It is a diamond-encrusted Cartier pen. Amazing. I will whip out a diamond-encrusted Cartier pen. I impress everybody with my one Bitcoin. So fancy, however, what use would that diamond-encrusted pen be? If it doesn't have any ink. So for every pen, there are a hundred million bits of ink we call these satoshi's; each one Bitcoin is composed of a hundred million bits of ink. In BTC. If I try to write on the ledger I can't write with any degree of finesse because if I do a ten-dollar transaction, it costs me eight dollars in fees - 80% of my ink is wasted on fees.
So now be a human, take your mind out of the technical gutter. I now give this piece of paper and this pen to an artist. My picture will be about as sophisticated as that (draws a small smiley face). Because it costs too much money to draw me a Mona Lisa. Bitcoin SV, with this pen - I get a Mona Lisa. It's as simple as that and if you don't understand that - you do not understand this technology. You have to take all the branding out the way. I really just understand it for that. The whole reason why they built on top of SV is that it's the only one that works at scale and it's only one that's going to have the whole bloody world frantically looking for one of these. And it's only 21 million. That is the investment pitch for Bitcoin SV. That's Bitcoin. And it’s up to you if you want to own a pen or not, if you want a useful pen or not, so that's the Bitcoin one.
Michael: Next question! How does Gravity compare to other companies like Revolut and other competitors?
David: Yes. I would go for that one. The main difference I would say is, as we mentioned previously, is the transparency aspect that we are trying to push forward and proof of reserves specifically for Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies on Monzo or Revolut. I think more specifically when you acquire, and I'm saying acquire you don't really have access to those ones. What you do is like just the value representation of the asset of the underlying asset, so if you try to purchase a choir or by or whatever you want to call it, you can't take ownership of it because you can't withdraw it and you can't even deposit anything. So Revolut does not facilitate any of that. So if you go on Revolut right now and you look to other cryptocurrencies, what you are doing is you are just speculating on a price - again back to square one. You cannot move the underlying assets, and it just doesn't do anything so if Revolut goes under for instance, right and it goes into liquidation, you can't do anything. There are those assets that don't belong to you. You were just speculating on a price that it's as if you're doing CFDs, so that's a major difference in transparency.
As I said is it's something that we are trying to integrate on any product that we try to put it out there; to make sure that the way drives that the users can understand how the product works and be confident that they can use it without being either scammed, nicked or you know, like they just need to know that this is the product is how it works as simple as that, and they trusted that's it. Like that's how we design all our products in regards to Revolut how it differs. Technically. I would say they are more sophisticated than us right now because obviously, they have support for multiple FX countries. They can do instantaneous things that we can't do yet. Still, we are trying to marry the technology with Bitcoin and what they do offer as FX and leverage Bitcoin to offer all those things on-chain transparently, so people can use it like they can transfer instantaneously to anyone outside of Revolut. You don't need to be part of Revolut to transfer money right if I see you in the street. I don't ask your bank details to get you a tenner. Like that's what the truly beautiful thing of cash is right. I just give it to you because I know who you are. And I entrust that that money is delivered because I am doing it. Like I know, the action of giving something is as simple as giving it. I'm not waiting for the bank to improve me giving money to Michael and vice versa. So I think a major difference is that that's what we are trying to achieve
Michael: Also. The world that we are entering right? So everyone talks about the data economy, artificial intelligence, automation. Big data is not a joke. It's a real thing and how this data economy is going to evolve and how the blockchain space has influenced this is actually being able to monetise your data. So what you need is a bank that actually speaks that language. So if you are now a new content creator on the Twitter equivalent on the blockchain, or the YouTube equipment on the blockchain, you're now going to be earning income in micropayments - in dust particles of USD, in dust particles of GBP, because the way that money on the internet works is kind of like how your electricity meter works for your house. Is there just churning away based on your usage as you're navigating your way and using one of your device's.
This Is the lubrication system of the new data economy of the machine-to-machine economy, and if you have, say a whole smart home set up in a way to generate you revenue because you're providing and feeding and data to services will pay for that data? Where does that money go? If it will be fragmented, or it is different places or if it will accumulate in its respective dust particles into a personal account for you when you're over up down at Selfridges you can buy a bag and transact with £200, and that transaction goes through in your debit card. It's a completely holistic approach to this micropayment economy, this data ownership economy and also the migration process away from these highly sensitive platforms. So for the likes on Instagram for likes of YouTube and the likes Twitter susceptible platforms. We strongly believe all will be superseded by the challenges being built on the same transparent infrastructure. We are telling ourselves and doing in a financial arena. The other arenas social media etc. that we are preparing for in fact is really a big announcement next week that we're going to be making about some people that we're working with who are working in these respective fields. So it's a whole ecology approach. We see Gravity is getting you guys ready for the data economy world. So that your bank is already speaking the language for you. You don't need to worry again about the plumbing. You just want to switch on the light when you go to your house and read a book. You don't want to then read up on how Edison made the light come to your house.
So off the back of that, I think I would use this as an opportunity to speak about the valuation of the company. So right now we are valued at £36 million, and this is the Iceberg effect valuation. Now with Bitstocks, we incorporated back in 2014. I bootstrapped the company with my own savings, and we lived and survived and thrived off our own personal progress model as well as two injections from myself to get the company where it is. So why didn't we get funding sooner? A couple of different reasons. The major one being our research mode. I don't believe in taking public cash when we're in research mode where we're trying to discern exactly what technology is and exactly how to position ourselves as a business to utilise this technology. We did that all of our own dimes, and as a while, we were doing that. We believe we managed to achieve a very apex perspective on technology and how to properly utilise the technology to be ahead of the game in a couple of years we stopped rolling this stuff out and that was the birth of the brainchild of Gravity. So with that being said, there is no predetermined path to follow with this technology. What does that mean? It means that we had to build everything in the house. Everything that we have built is proprietary, and we build it. We have a plethora of different aspects of the tech which maybe David you want to elaborate on, maybe finish off?
David: And you said people forget that part of the valuation is also the sunk cost. It's part of the valuation that you are pending to create, anything that you create in-house, the IP belongs to you obviously, too. So any innovation that you do as well is counted towards the valuation. We have lots of things in our arsenal, and some are obviously in the document, and they justify the value. Furthermore, I think the amount of the evaluation that we have and the goal that we want to achieve compared to the competitors that we have even a simple exchange like their functionality being like just a simple exchange a couple of years ago got acquired for 200 million, 500 million all those like crazy valuations and we don't believe on those valuations personally, and I think our valuation is very modest, to be honest, compared to others.
David: No, that's it. That's what I want to say, that just the valuation doesn't consist of a single, just the digit. There are lots of things which go into it, visions of what we create etc.
Michael: We’re actually already in the public beta, we're gaining customers, and we are just about to tackle £300,000 in fees in our public beta which is a very promising business model that hasn't even really properly launched - to be revenue-generating that degree at that level. But I do want to talk about our IP as well. So our draft, and we say draft because it's probably around about a maximum 35% of our overall tech stack, back from their agent service on what's being present in a value.
David: So I can't talk too much about what has been valued because it remains quite secretive but everything that was built as you say be it our budget infrastructure our money flows, our Cold Storage Solution, our signing terminals, the systems that we use, The Ledger system, the zero-sum everything that we've built. There are innovations on that field, which cover certain aspects for making the user assets safe and secure, cover legal aspects, cover innovation when it comes to how you deal with people's money to make them instant as well and available, so there are lots of things like that which adds up quite quickly once you think about it because we have been running, remind me Mike when the first time that we met - was 2013? Yeah, right. So people forget that, like 2013 and where we are now? It's eight years, right? It's a lot of time.
Michael: The biggest innovation really is our solvency solution, our particle swarm model, which will be a huge innovation in the space, to bring privacy on-chain, also to bring transparency on-chain as well, it hasn't been invented. We've invented this in order to bring it forward and start bringing the technology to the mainstream, that's a huge iceberg effect. That’s the thing that we’re most excited about and have an incredible amount of documentation on, that is about to start going into the academic review process, and we will be able to speak about and share it soon. And frustratingly other things that we can't speak about too much because of the engineering, we can't get them out there prematurely at the risk of sacrificing really our monetary position of IP and applicability.
Also, in terms of like direct competitors, which I think is a good example is Ziglu, who received funding recently through Seeders. They raised a £52 million valuation. They don't offer any other transparent features that we're building on Gravity. So we think we are actually, to be honest with you, quite frankly incredibly undervalued. And this is also one of the major reasons we decided to even do the crowdfunding campaign because solely about the funding. This is why we decided to do a crowdfunding campaign because it wasn't like this the primary source of funding as to what they're doing. It's not the funding aspect. We want stewards and ambassadors for the brand. People who really resonate with what it is that we are building and we are as the people build a company for the people. We’re building technology that we feel humanity really does need if we want to pioneer transparency in the world of finance and we want you guys to join us on that journey. We can't do this alone.
So the reason why we chose the crowdfunding campaign is that at this incredibly low valuation, this is where we want the people to come aboard. Otherwise, we'd just went down the VC route which is a lot easier really for a company alike. Like what are some key considerations that made us want to try this and not too aggressively shoot down a VC route. One definitely controls. Well, so VCs actually as you can imagine kind of want to have a very very large stake that influences control. We don't, we're not sensitive on the control aspect due to any money or greed factor is actually the technology that we're pioneering is so important we feel to get out there and live and see it's the day of light that we’re actually were quite fearful of banking and VC interest coming in and squashing our project for being too transparent. It is too disruptive. So us again going down a crowdfunding route brings a lot more attention to this and ironically even though we knew there would be a little bit more of a backfire; we actually wanted to introduce Bitcoin SV into a more mainstream audience and help educate and re-educate the understanding of what this technology is about, by saying this isn't an opinion, the whole example of pen paper is an absolute fact. However, you can still regard it as just my opinion. But if I build something on it, I say here, here, see because you're using it, then all of those opinions fall away. And now we start breaking into the mainstream side of things. We have very very aggressive aspirations for where we're at right now and what we're going to be in a few years in some time.
Michael: Is Gravity looking to implement any advantages for being a proactive Ambassador? David, you wanna attack that?
David: I would say it's more of a marketing question. I know the latest one, but I'm pretty sure that this will be changing again. So I don't want to promise anything which might change how we envision.
Michael: I want to talk about it basically, but that whole program is designed around proof of work. So the benefit of investing in the crowdfunding campaign - the traditional introducer program is a 20% referral fee that is 20 percent of all revenue generated on any individual you bring into the platform, indefinitely for the duration you hold your Gravity account. So it's a great model. It's a great way of bringing in sovereignty to the party in a way that doesn't require costly, and if you are an investor in our Crowdcube campaign, we actually make you an immediate Ambassador and we bump you up to 30% indefinitely on your account. So the more you share, the more people you have introduced to the platform the more revenue you’re making and it's paid out on a daily basis. So yeah, it's just proof of work. We need to get more out of the program, maybe things in the future, but I've been under strict instructions not to speak about things on our roadmap, right?
Michael: We'll take one more question. How do we envision doing future rounds of funding? And we should talk a little bit around the technicalities of STO and like really the ideal prime scenarios as to how we see private equity and also this spacing is technology touching on companies and how companies get funding how companies pursue exits. We think this is gonna be a huge space and something that we definitely want to be right in the front and centre of, elaborate a little bit on that.
David: Yeah, so a little bit of background story, maybe people know, maybe don't know but ultimately most of the unicorn companies go to IPO where it's publicly traded and finally the founders can cash out and early investors and also the employers were like at the early stages of the company can get something back after all this effort that they've put in now that's obviously something that we also have in mind, but not in the direct IPO way. What we want to do is we want to change the way that people IPO.
So there are lots of regular legal questions and also legal costs which are involved when you want to IPO, and we personally think it is not justified and it also limits the amount of companies who are able to achieve that status hence basically take advantage of that situation right? Now costs are really like exorbitant things, like really really high. We were talking in a region of like, millions and pounds and compliance costs and the associated legal costs. So for a small company who is raising, let’s say 1 million. They can't afford to do that. Right, because they need 5 million or so or even 10 to achieve that status. So I think publicly IPO’d companies right now that we have the way that this works is we have exchanges which list them. So let's say, New York Stock Exchange or London Stock Exchange, they decide to list them, and you are publicly traded. All right, but why would we go through all that bottleneck and you know through that hurdle where you can do all that online through Bitcoin blockchain, like literally you should be able to use like stablecoins to invest, or you should be able to use a stablecoin which is an asset of certain companies were right. The backing of the stablecoin. It doesn't need to be a fiat currency. It can be the underlying shares or anything of any company that legally you have ownership of now, and you can trade, and you can require to be paid dividends anything which comes from the legal standpoint basically is associated with that share.
We want to be the first people to go through this stage ourselves to make sure that we basically like trying to open the door for everyone else to be able to do that. But if no one is taking the risk that's never going to be done. Right? It's always the same thing the first person to open the door gets shot, right and then everyone else just floods seems like hey, we managed it, but nobody risks making the first move, and we want to do that. We really genuinely want to understand how this whole process can be facilitated for our end-users and to offer this as I would say, correct me if I'm wrong might, but as a gift, because once we do that, it becomes so much more cost-effective for people to do that and it becomes 24/7. It's no longer like we are closed during Bank hours. We are closing at the weekend. No, I can literally sit in my hotel room and buy shares in this company because I believe in it because I've done my due diligence and it's freely available. I don't need a broker.
Michael: Let’s tie our services to this, right? Yeah, you got Gravity. There are two segments to it. You've got the investment section which right now - digital assets, Bitcoin. Yeah, they'll be further assets which are not to speak on this time - assets coming out this year. And then you got the second section, which is the personal account services - like Monzo on the blockchain, right? So that's that service. Now the Investment Services we're going to want more assets. What assets will look like in a few years, is it just gonna be Bitcoin, ethereum, do I think Ripple is still going to be there?l I don't think these things will be the things that were trading in a few years, right? But then as a Gravity user on the investment section you want choices, you want different products, different services, different things to be involved in right if we're creating a new digital economy, I want us to be able to invest in new digital assets.
So one sector as a segment of digital assets that are in our opinion is going to be the next boom is gonna be bigger than the ICO boom is the legal, regulated version of the ICO boom being STOs that’s equity being published on the blockchain and as we said earlier in terms of contract law, and being witness to a contract taking place if the whole world is the witness, that means that as David will say - you could even program dividends into your contracts like you can program dividend payments into your contracts your smart contract you can make owning an equity position truly seamless in a business you could be sitting at a game of friendly poker with a couple of mates and trade say equity as soon as that's passed on in a new Bitcoin transaction, like sending the email immediately the dividends payments are being paid to the total ownership the way in which we own assets property, equity, debt will be tokenised to this.
So the solution to our first implementation of this technology is the stablecoin. But if you look and you connect the thread between the pieces that we are holding and the steps that we are taking and have a holistic view to what we're building here you’ll see why we're saying the real exit that we're pushing towards is the securitisation of our equity on the chain on Bitcoin SV because it's fully within in the whole mantra of what we're building with Gravity and we will encourage the tokenisation of other businesses and obviously naturally have them listed on our platform, which is why we are pushing for the regulatory route companies like Binance are not gonna be able to offer this this this function and this facility most exchanges won’t. We're going to have a complete purging effect within the next couple of years in the crypto space that will push away all the unregulated activity and will welcome all the regulated activity. So we are planning on being very hot on the heels with that. They will potentially be stopped for funding to speed it up. But right now we are already asking all the right questions with our liaisons about security tokens and STOs and the viability of us as a business providing an STO as an exit to our investors.
David: I think there was one person who posted a long question on Instagram that I don't have. I'm not sure if the person is still present, but if you want we can answer that question as well. I think three-four lines just flashed through while still being transparent to
Michael: Oh, that's a great question. How can you offer anonymity like cash does while still being transparent to the government's wanting to see user transactions?
David: I think we touched base briefly on what you said. But so we as a company we have a duty to safeguard the transactions of our customers. Okay, towards our customers, that's one side of the table. The other side of the table is that we have a duty to be compliant and respect the regulation right but at no stage the regulation saying that we need to send them the transactions that you as a personal individual at any given time that you are transacting that we need to make them aware of. That's not the case. What they're saying is that your transactions need to be in such form that if we require auditing right? We need to be able to access it. Now I think there is a misconception about lots of people where they say we are using Bitcoins. Hence we are basically like, anonymous right. Now I would say that that's completely wrong. To start off being anonymous is something that you can't have any trace and you can't prove that something happened. But on a public open-chain such as Bitcoin, you are leaving a trace forever that that happened. Now the link between the pseudo-anonymous or privacy that you have is different. Yes, somebody has done something. We don't know yet who it is. But if it comes to light then we'll know who it is, right they will know, and they can a be able to trace back up until to the point that they will know all the single transactions that person had so to answer the question in terms of our company as a Gravity what we are trying to do as Michael said, we have academic papers where we are trying to avoid.
Michael: I've literally got this sheet here. So I'm going to share and try to bring up to the camera one of a 30-page document. So it's one of our papers, but David could explain what he's explaining. So, this is our one sheet for my paper. This is the Gravity particle swarm model. So what David is about to describe and explain is that when a transaction comes into our system here, it explodes into millions of particles. They will operate quite often. It's like a firework explodes into millions of particles.
David: And the only person who knows about this and who keeps this information is us as a company, and as I said initially we have a duty to make sure that the transactions are safe and secure and information that we share is only if we need to share with the government such as, we are under investigation, there is an audit, or there's something really really like bad happened and if there's a court order well sorry, but we have to be compliant, but the way that we try to bring privacy is that we try to make your transaction as private as possible for someone not to be able to from externally to see your transaction habits your spendings. And that is something that we are offering basically as a service because we know that it is public and we know that it is out there. But the way that the transactions move and the way that it is random it is impossible to know where the money is going and how much it is going and for whom until you know the source of it which is us as a company which we have duty again. I'm trying to emphasise on this but we have a duty towards our customers to make them feel safe about it the way that they use it, and we have a duty towards the regulators as well. But only on certain conditions where it is really really something that we have to show.
Michael: I think the whole design philosophy behind Gravity is everything yet nothing. From a user standpoint - is everything else you can see. If she can see the order in the chaos all my transactions for something at Selfridges for something at Tescos for something at Primark and then you can see the so-called order in the chaos from everyone else's perspective it looks like nothing because it's just chaos. There's no way to discern or decipher what just happened. Because it's an explosion of interactions that aren't even links between the interactions to then find a pattern within those interactions. And then if we are subpoenaed, then we also have order in the chaos. We can bring up all the transactional records. So we are utilising a public system for transparency, but we're also utilising the public system and the nature of being able to break up a Bitcoin into millions of particles and the fact ironically that we are regulated which means that we can mix particles together. In order to create a solution that from the outside is like it is nigh on impossible to determine at the CERN, but from the inside, you have lots of order in all of the chaos.
And that is how you reintroduce the privacy nature of simulating a cash transaction with this technology, and these are the things that are really what I'm saying contributes to the iceberg effect of our valuation as a company and a little bit that’s peaking out right now that people are looking at 36 million really is not factoring the body of technology that we're building here at what our technology means for the world. Ironically that is producing itself right now today, and we designed our business plan and our model three years in advance in anticipation that it will be at a precipice in the world that we are today where the next conversation I bloody guarantee it, and it's unfortunate is happening by bloody guarantee after we get over the political one and health concerns. The next conversation will be economical. Right, and it’s gonna be about our financial systems and transparency in our financial systems. This technology and what we're building in Gravity has been absolutely timed to be perfectly positioned in the place when the world needs it the most, and we built the technology we built. We don't owe anyone anything for this; we built what we built to create what we're about to release and introduce. So, I think there are two questions that popped up.
David: I read the question, but I don't understand how the person wants to purchase from what basically. If this is about something where it's going to be priced - everything in Bitcoin. So you purchase just in Bitcoin. I don't think that will be the case personally. Like I don't see it happening at all. There are too many key factors outside of Bitcoin where the governments are not going to let go of their power which is the possibility to manage money. So I don't see that if the person is asking about sending something just like Bitcoin and pay to any currency such as an intermediate system, which does the transaction automatically. So let's say you see a price on Amazon which is 200 pounds and you only have Bitcoin, and you want to purchase that without worrying that you need to convert it. I think this is the model that let’s say Coinbase is done or Bitpay has done and they are …
Michael: The service that we're going to be offering second the kind of sentiment behind that is if I stay in crypto, I'm circumventing my tax obligations. That's BS. If you convert from Bitcoin into a theory of you came out of Bitcoin to Ethereum at a price point, and now you own Ethereum that's the second trade, but you will still have eyes on your Bitcoin trade, and now you've entered an Ethereum trade. So profits are due on a Bitcoin trade, and you're just going to create a minefield. Remember what we said all of these interactions on these blockchains. They're to be retrospectively acted upon. So the way that we are utilising operational security on these chains without any real understanding of how they work is dangerous, and there are tax implications for a lot of it.
David: Thankfully, it has been quite good on bringing back clarity on the regulation, and we were like in the dark side three-four years ago, but no longer that's not the case. So they know what they're doing today and know what is happening, and they are building the tools to eradicate this Behavior. It's as simple as that like Coinbase had contact with the IRS because they have requested balances and accounts and people information and it goes to say like how far the reach is. It's as simple as that, so if you are using a public open ledger which leaves traces for forever. I think you’re plainly stupid don't use it. That's not the purpose of it is this is not a good idea, and you shouldn't be doing that.
Michael: And this is why properly regulated institutions set up on right foundations are there to take care of all the heavy lifting for you and many burdens, the head strain of these burdens is important. That's how we get into the mainstream, and we stepped out of mom's basement. We need to really build real serious businesses and compete with the best of them to make the experience seamless so that my mom can use it and that's what Gravity is designed to do.
I just want to say thank you to everyone who has contributed to our crowdfunding. I believe you are now 161% overfunded. We still got 14 days to go, £800,000 raised, which is blown past the target of only half a million to be raised for the crowdfund campaign more importantly. We're just shy of 1170 investors; I believe which is like genuinely super humbling. And that also our demographic is pretty much our age group as well, the millennial demographic which is exactly the demographic that we're planning on targeting. It just goes to show people are resonating with what we are doing and that's the whole point, that’s why we wanted to do the crowdfunding campaign and it's a really welcoming community. And so thank you to everyone who's contributed and has been spreading the word - we welcome you on this journey with us to bring transparency to the world of finance. And I assure you we haven't even got started. I mean sitting having this conversation with David on cam. It's almost frustrating because it's so many things that we want to be talking about that we were just told fundamentally - you cannot talk about this stuff. So yeah, it's gonna be a great and amazing and very exciting year. Any last words from you, David?
David: I'm really grateful as well for everyone who takes time to tune in and ask questions. So thank you, everyone.Michael: All right, bye-bye. Everyone, all the best take care and spread the word. Let's bring transparency to the world of finance and banking and let’s use Bitcoin for Liberation for Humanity and hold Humanity accountable for our own actions. Join us! All the best! Peace, Love and Light.